I see a pressure wash guys all over the place that are fans of soft wash (real nice guys too, they welcomed me and my questions). The two would seem to be oppsites. Do I need a pressure washer to soft wash?
Chris Madden said
Dec 22, 2011
This can can be a touchy subject, as everyone has their own idea of what soft washing is. I will share my opinion and experience to help answer your question.
Do you need a pressure washer to Soft Wash? No...
Can you use a pressure washer to Soft Wash? Yes and No.....
My Experience:
I used a 4000psi 3.5 gpm pressure washer with 40 and 50 tips to wash homes for a couple of years. I would use the chemical injector to pull my cleaning mix from a 5gal. bucket. The cleaner would mix with the water and I would spray the homes exteriors in this manner. There are many people out there that clean this way, and it works. I no longer do this.
My Opinion:
Is this considered Soft Washing? Some say yes, but I say no.
My Experience:
I started playing with 12 volt pumps in late 2008, and went to an air compressor with a 7gpm air pump in the early part of 2009. I changed to 12volt pumps exclusively in 2010.
The air compressor/pumps work great, but they are expensive, take up allot of room, add weight that you have to haul around, are loud, require engine mantenance, and require gas which costs more money from your pocket to run.
The pressure washer setup is basically the same as the air compressor/pump setup. It also allows the user to "cheat" and add smaller tips which adds pressure when they want. In MY experience with MY setup even with the 40 and 50 tips the water hits the house harder than the 12volt setups.
The 12volt setup is small, takes up almost no space, is quiet, no gas to buy and carry, and are cheap with no maintenance except rinsing. Replacement is two wires and two hose clamps or Cam Connectors and you are back and running. For me it is a no brain-er that 12 volt systems will save you allot of money over the engine driven solutions out there.
There is a correct tool for every job. The work that I do dictates the use of 12volt systems. Other companies out there may have different work than I do, so a big setup may be the tool that they require.
I hope this helps shed some light on the question at hand.
Basically, you need to look at the work you are going to perform. What will be your target market, and what cost effective tools do you need to perform a quality and Safe job for your clients. Be sure to choose the right tools for your jobs.
Again this is my opinion, and others will probably chime in with theirs. Take notes, and choose the bits of info that will apply to you and your requirements.
Have a great night.
Chris
AC Lockyer said
Dec 23, 2011
I agree with Chris' assessment. Soft Washing is in my mind exclusively the use of an agricultural style pump and tank system to spray on a chemical that does all of the cleaning and in some cases where rinsing is needed ONLY a garden hose is needed to rinse away the residual chemicals and now bleached / dead organic material after cleaning. Anything where a pressure washer is used is an ADAPTATION of a pressure washer. Soft Washing came about because of my background in horticulture and working in plant nurseries for 7 years. I did not start in the pressure washing industry and adapt that to roof cleaning. I always attacked roof cleaning just like I attacked algae on plants.
Hope this helps,
AC
John Finch said
Dec 23, 2011
Good info guys thanks. I have a lot to consider in the next month.
Brian Friel said
Jan 3, 2012
I'm looking to upgrade to 8gpm machines next year to make us much more efficient. Anybody getting the kind of speed you get with 8gpm pressure washers from 12V pumps? I know the fatboy is a 7gpm pump, but is it really as efficient at the end of 200 feet of hose as the pressure washer?
Using 12volt works great but I found it is not going to allow us to do 3 or 4 house washes in a day. My 4 gpm pressure washers just aren't efficient enough to do the work that I want them to do in a day.
Any thoughts?
Brian
Josh Scavetta said
Jan 3, 2012
Hey Brian i have been using Dulavan pumps for a couple of years and found no problems with them. We spray most of our roof from being on the roof so we don't need a whole lot of pressure to spray. I had a fatboy hooked up to a 200 ft 5/8 hose which was too much pressure for my employees ( over spray). Problem with the fatboys are you cant feather the pressure so i went down to a 5850 which is 5 gmp. With the different wand attachments we use i would never need more pressure then that. We do 2 too 3 houses a day along with low pressure rinsing moss and licken off the roofs. Spraying takes no time at all.
The only thing having an air pressure pump would work better for would be when doing a large chimerical job where you have a ton of surface aria. But i have never used one
Hope this helps
Brian Friel said
Jan 3, 2012
Josh, I was referring more to doing house washing than roofs. I have 3 12 volt pumps and 1 AODD pump that we use for roof cleaning. I am partial to the 12 volt pumps for many reasons.
I'm looking for ways to stop taking pressure washers with me all together. We always have one with us in case we can upsell the house wash or a neighbor comes and asks if we can do house washing. We do the same thing that Chris described in his post by using 0040 and 2540 tips to apply and rinse our cleaners. The biggest thing limiting us now with our house washing is that a 4gpm machine can only move so quickly. Everyone I have talked to has said there is a huge leap in speed and productivity when you jump up to the 8gpm machines. They are bigger and much more expensive than the 4gpm machines so I am just looking to see if anyone has used 8gpm machines and compared them to the best 12 volt setups.
Brian
Chris Madden said
Jan 3, 2012
PA Roof Cleaning Company wrote:
I'm looking to upgrade to 8gpm machines next year to make us much more efficient. Anybody getting the kind of speed you get with 8gpm pressure washers from 12V pumps? I know the fatboy is a 7gpm pump, but is it really as efficient at the end of 200 feet of hose as the pressure washer?
Using 12volt works great but I found it is not going to allow us to do 3 or 4 house washes in a day. My 4 gpm pressure washers just aren't efficient enough to do the work that I want them to do in a day.
Any thoughts?
Brian
Hey Brian,
I was in the same situation as you several years ago. I am assuming you were talking about house washing? I was using a pressurewasher and downstreaming through 40 and 50 tips for my house washing. (applying chems, and rinsing) I was using 3.5-4gpm pumps and wanted to step it up a notch. I was going to buy an 8gpm machine just for rinsing as that process took longer than applying chems. My logic was more gpm to rinse faster.
Here is my opinion on washing equipment. It may or may not be helpful, but I hope it will help someone out there.
If you have a Need for an 8gpm pressure washer (doing commercial flat work etc.) then it would probably be worth spending the money. If you are like me and do house and roof cleaning than you can save a ton of money and us a roller pump pulling from a float tank to rinse just as fast if not faster than an 8gpm pressure washer.
these pumps only need a small 2-3hp engine to drive them.
For around $500 you can have 2 complete setups for rinsing.
These are rinsing monsters at a fraction of the cost of an 8gpm machine. The pump on that large washer will need rebuilding and replacement every few years if not every year, and are costly. You can buy a roller pump with a warranty and return it for a new one when it stops working. Not to mention they are cheap, and the return on investment is much better than an 8gpm for house washing. (total hrs used per year against cost of equipment, repairs, maint.) More money in your pocket instead of equipment.
I am setting up my system to run a pentaflex 7gpm 12v pump to pull from a float tank to rinse houses with water after Chem application. I have bought 2pcs. one to mount on the truck, and one spare. I want to stay away from any engine driven equipment because of fuel,maint, noise etc. I am using this as a selling point when talking with a potential client.
With my current 5850 setup we can do 4-5 homes a day. We have done 7 before, but it was hustling. I will be implementing the peltaflex rinse pump in the spring. We currently use customers water supply through 200ft of 3/4" hose on a truck mounted hose reel.
I hope this info helps you out. Let me know if I can do anything to help you out with your spring setup.
Have a great day!!
Chris
-- Edited by Palmetto Power Wash on Tuesday 3rd of January 2012 01:41:17 PM
Patrick Clark said
Jan 3, 2012
Great info Chris! When you use a pressure washer to apply chems to any surface, you will not get a 100% kill ration.
Last year I tried using a 5.5gpm12v pump to rinse. It was more of a hassle than anything. We just use 3/4 garden hose to rise and we can do four houses a day. But why would you want to do 4 houses when you can charge more and offer a better service that will last longer, is safer for their home, and cleans better than pressure washing.
Do less work for more money! Make your company stand out...
-- Edited by PrecisionProWash on Tuesday 3rd of January 2012 01:23:22 PM
Dan Signor said
Jan 3, 2012
I use the twin pump system from the Powerwash store for everything. We cleaned two roofs and exterior of house plus soft washed driveway in exactly two hours. It was about 1800 sqft. Home with separate four car carport and the entire front side of house was covered in algae. Came out beautiful.
Chris Madden said
Jan 3, 2012
Way to go Dan!!!
You knock-in em out of the park.
I use 12v exclusively for everything.
I love it and will never go back to downstreaming.
Chris
John Finch said
Jan 3, 2012
Watching reading guys and enjoying. Question about the lingo, is "down streaming" like using an x jet to reach high places?
Ray Burke said
Jan 3, 2012
Spray Wash Exterior Cleaning uses a 3/4 HP water pressure booster pump ( Myers & Delvan) for both washing and rinsing. We use a 1/2 ID hose rated to 250PSI bust strength.
Brian Friel said
Jan 3, 2012
Thanks Chris! That is exactly what I was looking for. Rinsing is what slows us down the most. 4 gallons per minute is fine to apply chems at, but it takes forever to rinse. I considered using my AODD to apply and rinse with but I don't want the hassle of the air compressor on the truck anymore. 12 volt systems are much easier for me to walk the guys through a repair while they are calling from the field.
Have you used the Pentaflex yet? I looked into it to replace my fatboy on one of my roof setups, but I didn't get real good feedback on it.
Ray, I would be interested in hearing a little more about your setup sometime.
Are you guys satisfied with concrete cleaning (walkways and patios) without having your pressure washers there? Getting good results without having to go so heavy on the cleaner that you are killing grass at the edge of the concrete?
Brian
Dan Signor said
Jan 3, 2012
I do not even use power washer to rinse. I only use either to get stubborn concrete or to speed up cleaning concrete, I have not used it on a house since September. This is the only way to go in my opinion.
Ray Burke said
Jan 3, 2012
Brian, I really enjoy these pumps, here's the skinny on them.... They will pump up to 8 GPM using the 1/2 inch hose. From my chemical tank I have 1 inch pipes gravity feeding the pump, and I get up to 5 GPM of solution/house/roof mix. I use a hose end garden trigger sprayer ( lowes/HD). I can shoot about 30 - 35 feet with decent water pressure and still have enough volume to knock down wasp nests.
The negative of these pumps are the pressure release. You have to be constantly letting off pressure every 10 seconds or so or it will blow your pipe system. They cost about $500 and run off electric power, which I get form either the customer or from my generator.
There are better systems out there, such as AC's, but I'm a creature of habit and this is what I've used for about 10 years.
Thanks Chris! That is exactly what I was looking for. Rinsing is what slows us down the most. 4 gallons per minute is fine to apply chems at, but it takes forever to rinse. I considered using my AODD to apply and rinse with but I don't want the hassle of the air compressor on the truck anymore. 12 volt systems are much easier for me to walk the guys through a repair while they are calling from the field.
Have you used the Pentaflex yet? I looked into it to replace my fatboy on one of my roof setups, but I didn't get real good feedback on it.
Ray, I would be interested in hearing a little more about your setup sometime.
Are you guys satisfied with concrete cleaning (walkways and patios) without having your pressure washers there? Getting good results without having to go so heavy on the cleaner that you are killing grass at the edge of the concrete?
Brian
Brian,
I have a 7gpm air pump I use to use, but all the support equipment, weight, and space made it a bad choice for my needs. I no longer pull a trailer, and all my equipment in mounted in the back of my truck.
I have not used the pentaflex yet. I purchased 2 of them a few months ago, but I will be re-configuring my setup for the spring. I will post pics as I go along. It will be a couple months when it gets warmer here. High of 32 deg today as a high and 16 deg this morning. The pentaflex like any pump needs to be "optimized" by the user for their particular needs. Everyone's setup is different with many variables.
Here are just a few examples:
- What size hose on the draw side
- What size hose feeding the hose reel
- What is the internal size of your hose reel
- What internal dia hose size are you using
- How long of a hose are you using
- Are you running through an accumulator tank
- What size fuse are you using
- What is the pressure switch set at
- Do you use a pressure relief valve to dump back into the tank
- How high are the roofs that you wash (higher creates more column pressure on pump, and the larger the dia hose the more column pressure)
Everyone has a slightly different setup, and required use of this equipment. I have found that tweaking the 12v pumps for your specific use is essential to having it work correctly, and reliably. Many guys do not do this and have problems with certain pumps and setups. I remember when the FAT BOY hit the scene..... Some guys used it with No problems, and others were burning them up, burning pressure switches, and fuses. These are not just plug and play, they need some tweaking, and some constant checking that they stay tweaked. As time passes, 12v systems need re-adjusting. I have to adjust mine if I am roof cleaning a two story house, as opposed to just staying on the ground and house washing. I have been very happy with the 12v setup and whould never change back.
Ray is using a booster pump. These are awesome. Very powerful and great flow rates. Chems will eat them like any other pump, but for fresh water rinsing they are great. The ones I looked at are expensive around $500 to start, but Ray can tell you what the real costs are. For the money I think the small 2-3 HP engine with a $99 roller pump at 9+gpm and up to 150psi is money better spent, and with a quick replacement of a cheap spare pump it is hard to beat. Maybe Ray will chime in with his experience. I have never used a booster pump, so this opinion is strictly on what I researched on these two different pumps.
When I clean concrete I spray away from the grass to the center of the drive. When I visit a potential clients home I look at all the concrete and how it is laid out.
- Does it slope to the garage or to the road
- Does it slope back into a landscape bed
- Etc.
If I think I will have a problem with runoff to a lawn or a landscaped area I do not try and up-sell, as I do not want to risk damaging any Client property. Now with this said I Have purchased the plant wash from AC, and I will be spraying this along the sides of the concrete on the lawn and in the beds, so maybe I will start up-selling this. I am very careful, maybe too careful not to harm any plant, grass etc.
I hope this helped some.
Talk with you soon
Chris
Ray Burke said
Jan 3, 2012
Big pro to my booster pump is the peace and quiet...many days I don't even hear a gas engine running, just a gentle hum of electric pump. I get a lot of life out of my pumps as I use them for rinsing after chem application, so they always get a 30 minute clean out during the rinse. Works much faster than a fatboy or similar system, but they will eventually die.
I've worked as high as 120 feet and still had serviceable pressure with these pumps. At four to six stories there is no pressure reduction noticeable.
I've considered roller pumps before, just can't seem to gravitate away from my system.
Brian Friel said
Jan 4, 2012
I appreciate the info fellas. I guess I have some more investigation to do on my part. We power washed a few really large townhome communities (over 150 units) this year. They worked out great, but I know I could have cut my time in half if I had a much larger volume rinse. The property manager has already told me he has a few other communities he wants me to do next year so I would really like to get them done a little faster.
I'm definitely interested in the roller pump setup. I can keep that pretty compact and it does look like a pretty simple change out for my guys if they need it. I like to keep things simple for them.
I'm concerned about the need to let pressure off the booster pump so frequently. It would be fine if I were on every job, but my guys are never as diligent as I am and next year I will be on less and less jobs. I don't want them ruining $500 pumps on me.
I asked my chlorine supplier this fall about the pumps they use for chlorine transfer on their trucks. I was interested in it for roof cleaning. They use a spa pump that is designed for 20+ gallons per minute, but they are also 120v pumps. It seemed like a bit of overkill for roof cleaning. They claim they never rinse the pumps and have been using them daily for over 3 years. Every winter they take the pump head apart to remove the crystalized salt build up, but thats it. The driver said they are around $500 as well. Maybe I'll get some info on the model of that pump too. I buy enough chlorine from them so they should be willing to help.
Thanks again.
Brian
AC Lockyer said
Jan 4, 2012
spray wash wrote:
Brian, I really enjoy these pumps, here's the skinny on them.... They will pump up to 8 GPM using the 1/2 inch hose. From my chemical tank I have 1 inch pipes gravity feeding the pump, and I get up to 5 GPM of solution/house/roof mix. I use a hose end garden trigger sprayer ( lowes/HD). I can shoot about 30 - 35 feet with decent water pressure and still have enough volume to knock down wasp nests.
The negative of these pumps are the pressure release. You have to be constantly letting off pressure every 10 seconds or so or it will blow your pipe system. They cost about $500 and run off electric power, which I get form either the customer or from my generator.
There are better systems out there, such as AC's, but I'm a creature of habit and this is what I've used for about 10 years.
I've a attached a photo of my back-up rig that I'm building. Its not finished and not pretty....
I like the excellorated rinse pump idea that Ray uses. There is plenty of room on a SoftWash Cradle System for a buffer tank and a rinse pump and reel that Ray is speaking of.
AC
Peter Blau said
Jan 9, 2013
Chris Madden wrote:
This can can be a touchy subject, as everyone has their own idea of what soft washing is. I will share my opinion and experience to help answer your question.
Do you need a pressure washer to Soft Wash? No...
Can you use a pressure washer to Soft Wash? Yes and No.....
My Experience:
I used a 4000psi 3.5 gpm pressure washer with 40 and 50 tips to wash homes for a couple of years. I would use the chemical injector to pull my cleaning mix from a 5gal. bucket. The cleaner would mix with the water and I would spray the homes exteriors in this manner. There are many people out there that clean this way, and it works. I no longer do this.
My Opinion:
Is this considered Soft Washing? Some say yes, but I say no.
My Experience:
I started playing with 12 volt pumps in late 2008, and went to an air compressor with a 7gpm air pump in the early part of 2009. I changed to 12volt pumps exclusively in 2010.
The air compressor/pumps work great, but they are expensive, take up allot of room, add weight that you have to haul around, are loud, require engine mantenance, and require gas which costs more money from your pocket to run.
The pressure washer setup is basically the same as the air compressor/pump setup. It also allows the user to "cheat" and add smaller tips which adds pressure when they want. In MY experience with MY setup even with the 40 and 50 tips the water hits the house harder than the 12volt setups.
The 12volt setup is small, takes up almost no space, is quiet, no gas to buy and carry, and are cheap with no maintenance except rinsing. Replacement is two wires and two hose clamps or Cam Connectors and you are back and running. For me it is a no brain-er that 12 volt systems will save you allot of money over the engine driven solutions out there.
There is a correct tool for every job. The work that I do dictates the use of 12volt systems. Other companies out there may have different work than I do, so a big setup may be the tool that they require.
I hope this helps shed some light on the question at hand.
Basically, you need to look at the work you are going to perform. What will be your target market, and what cost effective tools do you need to perform a quality and Safe job for your clients. Be sure to choose the right tools for your jobs.
Again this is my opinion, and others will probably chime in with theirs. Take notes, and choose the bits of info that will apply to you and your requirements.
Have a great night.
Chris
Great advice, great advise. Thank you Chris.
Steve Salley said
Jan 11, 2013
Ditto on the 12v and leave the noisy pressure washers at home!
We do have one and we will use it when we do concrete deep cleaning so we can apply preservation coatings to concrete etc. I hate the noise!
Ray and Chris have both been singing the praises for booster pumps and we are going to listen in 2013! I also like the advice to charge more and do less. We have the wonderful reality in our market of being the only one around, so our prices are not squeezed.
However, positioning your company as the true professional who really will take the time to protect your neighbor's home from high pressure erosion cleaning methods, will pay rich dividends in the days ahead. Be the new generation service in your market!
Thanks for such friendly open discussions and the allowance of each one to set his system up per his desires. Very refreshing never to be attacked, just educated.
Doug Ford said
Jan 15, 2013
I have both on my sws system. I think AC calls it the Mack Daddy system. I like to have the option to use it on concrete if needed and in some cases we do prep work for investors in the area where we clean the roof, siding and concrete and we can get things done quicker with three people working at the same time. Also we might need to remove a little loose paint in the house wash rinse process.
Here is a picture of the back.
-- Edited by Midsouth Prowash on Tuesday 15th of January 2013 11:35:30 PM
Ok for some reason it keeps uploading the wrong pic. Maybe it is the iPad issue
-- Edited by Midsouth Prowash on Tuesday 15th of January 2013 11:36:52 PM
I see a pressure wash guys all over the place that are fans of soft wash (real nice guys too, they welcomed me and my questions). The two would seem to be oppsites. Do I need a pressure washer to soft wash?
This can can be a touchy subject, as everyone has their own idea of what soft washing is. I will share my opinion and experience to help answer your question.
Do you need a pressure washer to Soft Wash? No...
Can you use a pressure washer to Soft Wash? Yes and No.....
My Experience:
I used a 4000psi 3.5 gpm pressure washer with 40 and 50 tips to wash homes for a couple of years. I would use the chemical injector to pull my cleaning mix from a 5gal. bucket. The cleaner would mix with the water and I would spray the homes exteriors in this manner. There are many people out there that clean this way, and it works. I no longer do this.
My Opinion:
Is this considered Soft Washing? Some say yes, but I say no.
My Experience:
I started playing with 12 volt pumps in late 2008, and went to an air compressor with a 7gpm air pump in the early part of 2009. I changed to 12volt pumps exclusively in 2010.
The air compressor/pumps work great, but they are expensive, take up allot of room, add weight that you have to haul around, are loud, require engine mantenance, and require gas which costs more money from your pocket to run.
The pressure washer setup is basically the same as the air compressor/pump setup. It also allows the user to "cheat" and add smaller tips which adds pressure when they want. In MY experience with MY setup even with the 40 and 50 tips the water hits the house harder than the 12volt setups.
The 12volt setup is small, takes up almost no space, is quiet, no gas to buy and carry, and are cheap with no maintenance except rinsing. Replacement is two wires and two hose clamps or Cam Connectors and you are back and running. For me it is a no brain-er that 12 volt systems will save you allot of money over the engine driven solutions out there.
There is a correct tool for every job. The work that I do dictates the use of 12volt systems. Other companies out there may have different work than I do, so a big setup may be the tool that they require.
I hope this helps shed some light on the question at hand.
Basically, you need to look at the work you are going to perform. What will be your target market, and what cost effective tools do you need to perform a quality and Safe job for your clients. Be sure to choose the right tools for your jobs.
Again this is my opinion, and others will probably chime in with theirs. Take notes, and choose the bits of info that will apply to you and your requirements.
Have a great night.
Chris
Hope this helps,
AC
I'm looking to upgrade to 8gpm machines next year to make us much more efficient. Anybody getting the kind of speed you get with 8gpm pressure washers from 12V pumps? I know the fatboy is a 7gpm pump, but is it really as efficient at the end of 200 feet of hose as the pressure washer?
Using 12volt works great but I found it is not going to allow us to do 3 or 4 house washes in a day. My 4 gpm pressure washers just aren't efficient enough to do the work that I want them to do in a day.
Any thoughts?
Brian
The only thing having an air pressure pump would work better for would be when doing a large chimerical job where you have a ton of surface aria. But i have never used one
Hope this helps
I was referring more to doing house washing than roofs. I have 3 12 volt pumps and 1 AODD pump that we use for roof cleaning. I am partial to the 12 volt pumps for many reasons.
I'm looking for ways to stop taking pressure washers with me all together. We always have one with us in case we can upsell the house wash or a neighbor comes and asks if we can do house washing. We do the same thing that Chris described in his post by using 0040 and 2540 tips to apply and rinse our cleaners. The biggest thing limiting us now with our house washing is that a 4gpm machine can only move so quickly. Everyone I have talked to has said there is a huge leap in speed and productivity when you jump up to the 8gpm machines. They are bigger and much more expensive than the 4gpm machines so I am just looking to see if anyone has used 8gpm machines and compared them to the best 12 volt setups.
Brian
Hey Brian,
I was in the same situation as you several years ago. I am assuming you were talking about house washing? I was using a pressurewasher and downstreaming through 40 and 50 tips for my house washing. (applying chems, and rinsing) I was using 3.5-4gpm pumps and wanted to step it up a notch. I was going to buy an 8gpm machine just for rinsing as that process took longer than applying chems. My logic was more gpm to rinse faster.
Here is my opinion on washing equipment. It may or may not be helpful, but I hope it will help someone out there.
If you have a Need for an 8gpm pressure washer (doing commercial flat work etc.) then it would probably be worth spending the money. If you are like me and do house and roof cleaning than you can save a ton of money and us a roller pump pulling from a float tank to rinse just as fast if not faster than an 8gpm pressure washer.
Delavan Cast Iron 4-Roller Pump — 9.2 GPM, 150 PSI
http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200323963_200323963
these pumps only need a small 2-3hp engine to drive them.
For around $500 you can have 2 complete setups for rinsing.
These are rinsing monsters at a fraction of the cost of an 8gpm machine. The pump on that large washer will need rebuilding and replacement every few years if not every year, and are costly. You can buy a roller pump with a warranty and return it for a new one when it stops working. Not to mention they are cheap, and the return on investment is much better than an 8gpm for house washing. (total hrs used per year against cost of equipment, repairs, maint.) More money in your pocket instead of equipment.
I am setting up my system to run a pentaflex 7gpm 12v pump to pull from a float tank to rinse houses with water after Chem application. I have bought 2pcs. one to mount on the truck, and one spare. I want to stay away from any engine driven equipment because of fuel,maint, noise etc. I am using this as a selling point when talking with a potential client.
With my current 5850 setup we can do 4-5 homes a day. We have done 7 before, but it was hustling. I will be implementing the peltaflex rinse pump in the spring. We currently use customers water supply through 200ft of 3/4" hose on a truck mounted hose reel.
I hope this info helps you out. Let me know if I can do anything to help you out with your spring setup.
Have a great day!!
Chris
-- Edited by Palmetto Power Wash on Tuesday 3rd of January 2012 01:41:17 PM
Great info Chris!
When you use a pressure washer to apply chems to any surface, you will not get a 100% kill ration.
Last year I tried using a 5.5gpm12v pump to rinse. It was more of a hassle than anything. We just use 3/4 garden hose to rise and we can do four houses a day. But why would you want to do 4 houses when you can charge more and offer a better service that will last longer, is safer for their home, and cleans better than pressure washing.
Do less work for more money! Make your company stand out...
-- Edited by PrecisionProWash on Tuesday 3rd of January 2012 01:23:22 PM
Way to go Dan!!!
You knock-in em out of the park.
I use 12v exclusively for everything.
I love it and will never go back to downstreaming.
Chris
Have you used the Pentaflex yet? I looked into it to replace my fatboy on one of my roof setups, but I didn't get real good feedback on it.
Ray, I would be interested in hearing a little more about your setup sometime.
Are you guys satisfied with concrete cleaning (walkways and patios) without having your pressure washers there? Getting good results without having to go so heavy on the cleaner that you are killing grass at the edge of the concrete?
Brian
Brian, I really enjoy these pumps, here's the skinny on them....
They will pump up to 8 GPM using the 1/2 inch hose. From my chemical tank I have 1 inch pipes gravity feeding the pump, and I get up to 5 GPM of solution/house/roof mix. I use a hose end garden trigger sprayer ( lowes/HD). I can shoot about 30 - 35 feet with decent water pressure and still have enough volume to knock down wasp nests.
The negative of these pumps are the pressure release. You have to be constantly letting off pressure every 10 seconds or so or it will blow your pipe system. They cost about $500 and run off electric power, which I get form either the customer or from my generator.
There are better systems out there, such as AC's, but I'm a creature of habit and this is what I've used for about 10 years.
http://www.femyers.com/products/watersystems/centrifugal/pb%20series.html
I've a attached a photo of my back-up rig that I'm building. Its not finished and not pretty....
Brian,
I have a 7gpm air pump I use to use, but all the support equipment, weight, and space made it a bad choice for my needs. I no longer pull a trailer, and all my equipment in mounted in the back of my truck.
I have not used the pentaflex yet. I purchased 2 of them a few months ago, but I will be re-configuring my setup for the spring. I will post pics as I go along. It will be a couple months when it gets warmer here. High of 32 deg today as a high and 16 deg this morning. The pentaflex like any pump needs to be "optimized" by the user for their particular needs. Everyone's setup is different with many variables.
Here are just a few examples:
- What size hose on the draw side
- What size hose feeding the hose reel
- What is the internal size of your hose reel
- What internal dia hose size are you using
- How long of a hose are you using
- Are you running through an accumulator tank
- What size fuse are you using
- What is the pressure switch set at
- Do you use a pressure relief valve to dump back into the tank
- How high are the roofs that you wash (higher creates more column pressure on pump, and the larger the dia hose the more column pressure)
Everyone has a slightly different setup, and required use of this equipment. I have found that tweaking the 12v pumps for your specific use is essential to having it work correctly, and reliably. Many guys do not do this and have problems with certain pumps and setups. I remember when the FAT BOY hit the scene..... Some guys used it with No problems, and others were burning them up, burning pressure switches, and fuses. These are not just plug and play, they need some tweaking, and some constant checking that they stay tweaked. As time passes, 12v systems need re-adjusting. I have to adjust mine if I am roof cleaning a two story house, as opposed to just staying on the ground and house washing. I have been very happy with the 12v setup and whould never change back.
Ray is using a booster pump. These are awesome. Very powerful and great flow rates. Chems will eat them like any other pump, but for fresh water rinsing they are great. The ones I looked at are expensive around $500 to start, but Ray can tell you what the real costs are. For the money I think the small 2-3 HP engine with a $99 roller pump at 9+gpm and up to 150psi is money better spent, and with a quick replacement of a cheap spare pump it is hard to beat. Maybe Ray will chime in with his experience. I have never used a booster pump, so this opinion is strictly on what I researched on these two different pumps.
When I clean concrete I spray away from the grass to the center of the drive. When I visit a potential clients home I look at all the concrete and how it is laid out.
- Does it slope to the garage or to the road
- Does it slope back into a landscape bed
- Etc.
If I think I will have a problem with runoff to a lawn or a landscaped area I do not try and up-sell, as I do not want to risk damaging any Client property. Now with this said I Have purchased the plant wash from AC, and I will be spraying this along the sides of the concrete on the lawn and in the beds, so maybe I will start up-selling this. I am very careful, maybe too careful not to harm any plant, grass etc.
I hope this helped some.
Talk with you soon
Chris
I've worked as high as 120 feet and still had serviceable pressure with these pumps. At four to six stories there is no pressure reduction noticeable.
I've considered roller pumps before, just can't seem to gravitate away from my system.
I appreciate the info fellas. I guess I have some more investigation to do on my part. We power washed a few really large townhome communities (over 150 units) this year. They worked out great, but I know I could have cut my time in half if I had a much larger volume rinse. The property manager has already told me he has a few other communities he wants me to do next year so I would really like to get them done a little faster.
I'm definitely interested in the roller pump setup. I can keep that pretty compact and it does look like a pretty simple change out for my guys if they need it. I like to keep things simple for them.
I'm concerned about the need to let pressure off the booster pump so frequently. It would be fine if I were on every job, but my guys are never as diligent as I am and next year I will be on less and less jobs. I don't want them ruining $500 pumps on me.
I asked my chlorine supplier this fall about the pumps they use for chlorine transfer on their trucks. I was interested in it for roof cleaning. They use a spa pump that is designed for 20+ gallons per minute, but they are also 120v pumps. It seemed like a bit of overkill for roof cleaning. They claim they never rinse the pumps and have been using them daily for over 3 years. Every winter they take the pump head apart to remove the crystalized salt build up, but thats it. The driver said they are around $500 as well. Maybe I'll get some info on the model of that pump too. I buy enough chlorine from them so they should be willing to help.
Thanks again.
Brian
I like the excellorated rinse pump idea that Ray uses. There is plenty of room on a SoftWash Cradle System for a buffer tank and a rinse pump and reel that Ray is speaking of.
AC
Great advice, great advise. Thank you Chris.
We do have one and we will use it when we do concrete deep cleaning so we can apply preservation coatings to concrete etc. I hate the noise!
Ray and Chris have both been singing the praises for booster pumps and we are going to listen in 2013! I also like the advice to charge more and do less. We have the wonderful reality in our market of being the only one around, so our prices are not squeezed.
However, positioning your company as the true professional who really will take the time to protect your neighbor's home from high pressure erosion cleaning methods, will pay rich dividends in the days ahead. Be the new generation service in your market!
Thanks for such friendly open discussions and the allowance of each one to set his system up per his desires. Very refreshing never to be attacked, just educated.
Here is a picture of the back.
-- Edited by Midsouth Prowash on Tuesday 15th of January 2013 11:35:30 PM Ok for some reason it keeps uploading the wrong pic. Maybe it is the iPad issue
-- Edited by Midsouth Prowash on Tuesday 15th of January 2013 11:36:52 PM